Legislature(2007 - 2008)CAPITOL 106

03/13/2008 03:00 PM House HEALTH, EDUCATION & SOCIAL SERVICES


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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
*+ HB 190 NURSING MOTHERS IN WORKPLACE TELECONFERENCED
Moved CSHB 190(HES) Out of Committee
*+ HB 397 POSTSECONDARY SCHOLARSHIPS TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
*+ HB 403 APPROP: SCHOLARSHIP FUND TELECONFERENCED
Scheduled But Not Heard
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
                    ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE                                                                                  
 HOUSE HEALTH, EDUCATION AND SOCIAL SERVICES STANDING COMMITTEE                                                               
                         March 13, 2008                                                                                         
                           3:04 p.m.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Representative Peggy Wilson, Chair                                                                                              
Representative Bob Roses, Vice Chair                                                                                            
Representative Anna Fairclough                                                                                                  
Representative Wes Keller                                                                                                       
Representative Paul Seaton                                                                                                      
Representative Sharon Cissna                                                                                                    
Representative Berta Gardner                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
All members present                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
SPONSOR SUBSTITUTE FOR HOUSE BILL NO. 190                                                                                       
"An Act relating to break times for employees who nurse a                                                                       
child."                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     - MOVED CSSSHB 190(HES) OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 397                                                                                                              
"An Act creating a postsecondary scholarship grant program for                                                                  
Alaska residents based on high achievement and financial need."                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     - HEARD AND HELD                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 403                                                                                                              
"An Act appropriating $100,000,000 to the Alaska achievers'                                                                     
scholarship fund; and providing for an effective date."                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     - SCHEDULED BUT NOT HEARD                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB 190                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: NURSING MOTHERS IN WORKPLACE                                                                                       
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) CISSNA                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
03/12/07       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
03/12/07       (H)       HES, L&C                                                                                               
04/25/07       (H)       SPONSOR SUBSTITUTE INTRODUCED                                                                          
04/25/07       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
04/25/07       (H)       HES, L&C                                                                                               
03/13/08       (H)       HES AT 3:00 PM CAPITOL 106                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB 397                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: POSTSECONDARY SCHOLARSHIPS                                                                                         
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) GUTTENBERG                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
02/19/08       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
02/19/08       (H)       HES, FIN                                                                                               
03/13/08       (H)       HES AT 3:00 PM CAPITOL 106                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
WITNESS REGISTER                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
ANNA SORENSEN, Staff                                                                                                            
to Representative Sharon Cissna                                                                                                 
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:  Presented HB 190 on behalf of                                                                            
Representative Cissna, prime sponsor.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
GREY MITCHELL, Director                                                                                                         
Central Office                                                                                                                  
Division of Labor Standards & Safety                                                                                            
Department of Labor & Workforce Development (DLWD) Juneau,                                                                      
Alaska                                                                                                                          
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified during the hearing on HB 190.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CATHERINE TAPEY, President                                                                                                      
Alaska Breastfeeding Coalition                                                                                                  
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 190.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
DEBRA GOLDEN, Nurse Consultant                                                                                                  
Section of Women, Children & Family Health                                                                                      
Division of Public Health                                                                                                       
Department of Health & Social Services                                                                                          
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 190.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
ERIN MACARTHUR, Pediatrician; Board Member                                                                                      
Alaska Breastfeeding Coalition                                                                                                  
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 190.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
COLLEEN TURNER, Executive Director                                                                                              
Resource Center for Parents and Children                                                                                        
Fairbanks, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 190.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
DEADRA HALL, Nursing mother; Employee                                                                                           
ASEA/AFSCME Local 52                                                                                                            
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 190.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
WILLIE ANDERSON, Lobbyist                                                                                                       
National Education Association (NEA) Alaska                                                                                     
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 190.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE DAVID GUTTENBERG                                                                                                 
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:  Introduced HB 397, as the prime sponsor.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
WILLIAM ANDREWS, Member                                                                                                         
Board of Regents                                                                                                                
University of Alaska; Student                                                                                                   
University of Alaska Southeast                                                                                                  
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 397 and 403.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
DIANE BARRANS, Executive Director                                                                                               
Postsecondary Education Commission                                                                                              
Department of Education and Early Development                                                                                   
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified on HB 190.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
ANNAMARIA DICOLA, Student                                                                                                       
University of Alaska                                                                                                            
Homer, Alaska                                                                                                                   
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support for HB 397 and 403.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
JOHN ROBERSON III, Student Body President                                                                                       
University of Anchorage                                                                                                         
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 397 and 403.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
RYAN BUCHHOLDT, Student                                                                                                         
University of Alaska Anchorage                                                                                                  
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 397 and 403.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MISTY M. GIL MARTINEZ, Student                                                                                                  
University of Alaska Fairbanks                                                                                                  
Fairbanks, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 397.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MEREDITH CAMERON, Student                                                                                                       
University of Alaska Fairbanks                                                                                                  
Fairbanks, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 397.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
DAVID CHILDERS, Student                                                                                                         
University of Alaska Anchorage                                                                                                  
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 397 and HB 403.                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MARY GOWER, Director                                                                                                            
Enrollment Services                                                                                                             
University of Alaska Fairbanks                                                                                                  
Fairbanks, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 397 and HB 403.                                                               
                                                                                                                                
DELIGHT KENNEDY, Student                                                                                                        
University of Alaska Fairbanks                                                                                                  
Fairbanks, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 397 and HB 403.                                                               
                                                                                                                                
CHRISTOPHER STEFANOVICH, Student                                                                                                
University of Alaska Anchorage                                                                                                  
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 397 and 403.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
JAKE HAMBURG, Student Body President                                                                                            
University of Alaska Fairbanks                                                                                                  
Fairbanks, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 397 and HB 403.                                                               
                                                                                                                                
CASEY MELIAH, Student                                                                                                           
University of Alaska Anchorage                                                                                                  
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 397 and  HB 403.                                                              
                                                                                                                                
DANIEL SWISHER, Student                                                                                                         
University of Alaska Fairbanks                                                                                                  
Fairbanks, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 397 and HB 403.                                                               
                                                                                                                                
SETH HOLTSHOUSER, Student                                                                                                       
University of Alaska Anchorage                                                                                                  
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 397 and HB 403.                                                               
                                                                                                                                
JOSEPH HICKMAN, Director                                                                                                        
Student Support Services                                                                                                        
University of Alaska Fairbanks (UAF)                                                                                            
Fairbanks, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION  STATEMENT:   Testified in   support  of   HB 397 and  HB
403.                                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
ANDY ANGAIAK, Director                                                                                                          
Upward Bound Program                                                                                                            
University of Alaska Fairbanks                                                                                                  
Fairbanks, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:   Testified during  the hearing on HB  397 and                                                            
HB 403.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MELANIE K. LEYDON, Student                                                                                                      
University of Alaska Anchorage (UAA)                                                                                            
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 397 and HB 403.                                                               
                                                                                                                                
KEVIN TURNBOUGH, Employee                                                                                                       
Upward Bound                                                                                                                    
University of Alaska Fairbanks                                                                                                  
Fairbanks, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:   Testified during  the hearing on HB  397 and                                                            
HB 403.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
DANA L.  THOMAS, Professor  of Statistics;  Assistant Provost  for                                                              
General Studies                                                                                                                 
University of Alaska Fairbanks                                                                                                  
Fairbanks, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 397.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
LINDSEY FORREST, Student Government President                                                                                   
University of Alaska Southeast                                                                                                  
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 397 and HB 403.                                                               
                                                                                                                                
ACTION NARRATIVE                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR PEGGY WILSON  called the House Health, Education  and Social                                                            
Services  Standing  Committee  meeting  to order  at  3:04:54  PM.                                                            
Representatives  Wilson,   Roses,  Keller,  Seaton,   Cissna,  and                                                              
Gardner  were  present  at  the call  to  order.    Representative                                                              
Fairclough arrived as the meeting was in progress.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
3:05:42 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
HB 190-NURSING MOTHERS IN WORKPLACE                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
3:07:42 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON announced  that the first order of  business would be                                                              
SPONSOR  SUBSTITUTE FOR  HOUSE BILL  NO. 190,"An  Act relating  to                                                              
break times  for employees  who nurse a  child."  She  then stated                                                              
that Version E was before the committee.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
3:07:52 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ANNA  SORENSEN,  staff  to Representative  Sharon  Cissna,  Alaska                                                              
State Legislature,  related that  in February, 2007,  the governor                                                              
established  the Alaska  Health Care  Strategies Planning  Council                                                              
to  address health  care  issues.   The  highest  priority of  the                                                              
council  was the  recommendation  of personal  responsibility  for                                                              
one's health  care.   House Bill 190  complies with  this priority                                                              
by  ensuring that  nursing  mothers are  not  hindered from  being                                                              
personally  responsible  for  their  own,  and  their  children's,                                                              
health.   She  explained  that  mothers  are the  fastest  growing                                                              
segment  of the U.  S. labor  force, approximately  70 percent  of                                                              
employed mothers  with children  younger than  three years  of age                                                              
work full time,  one-third of these mothers return  to work within                                                              
three  months  after  birth,  and  two-thirds  return  within  six                                                              
months.  Furthermore,  mothers who work outside  the home initiate                                                              
breastfeeding  at the  same  rate  as mothers  who  stay at  home;                                                              
however,  the   breastfeeding  rate   declines  substantially   in                                                              
mothers  who return  to work resulting  in a  shorter duration  of                                                              
breastfeeding of their children.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
3:09:54 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. SORENSEN  continued to  explain that in  Alaska, from  2000 to                                                              
2003,  43 percent  of  mothers of  newborn  infants reported  that                                                              
they were  currently in school or  working outside of  their home.                                                              
In  addition,  of  the mothers  who  stopped  breastfeeding  their                                                              
infants,  22 percent  reported that  one  reason they  did so  was                                                              
because they were  returning to work or school.  The United States                                                              
Breastfeeding  Committee   reports  that  breastfeeding   provides                                                              
numerous  well documented  health benefits  to mothers  including:                                                              
reduced  risks for  breast  and ovarian  cancer;  reduced risk  of                                                              
bleeding after birth;  reduced rate of diabetes;  reduced rates of                                                              
osteoporosis  and  bone  fractures; the  promotion  of  postpartum                                                              
weight loss; and the promotion of emotional good health.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
3:12:34 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS.  SORENSEN   then  listed   the  many  benefits   breastfeeding                                                              
provides  for infants  and  the  developing child.    Furthermore,                                                              
benefits  to employers  include  less employee  absenteeism,  less                                                              
employee  turnover,  faster  return from  maternity  leave,  lower                                                              
utilization  of  employee  health   care  benefits,  and  improved                                                              
morale  and  loyalty.    Fifteen   states  have  laws  related  to                                                              
breastfeeding  or  expressing  milk   in  the  workplace  and  Ms.                                                              
Sorensen explained the different standards of each.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
3:17:00 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS.  SORENSEN  indicated  that  SSHB 190,  Version  E,  has  three                                                              
components that  employers must provide:  reasonable  unpaid break                                                              
time  to an  employee who  is the  nursing  mother of  a child;  a                                                              
private,  secure,   and  sanitary  room  where  an   employee  can                                                              
breastfeed  or express  milk;  and  a procedure  for  enforcement.                                                              
She  then   gave  the  definitions   for  "employer"   and  "undue                                                              
hardship" that are  proposed in the bill and noted  that there are                                                              
two amendments offered by Representative Cissna.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
3:19:23 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SEATON asked  for  the definition  of  "reasonable                                                              
unpaid break time" as allowed by the bill.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
3:20:19 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. SORENSEN explained  that a reasonable time  generally includes                                                              
15 minutes to 30 minutes to nurse or express milk.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
3:20:32 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON observed  that some employees may  require additional                                                              
time.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
3:21:02 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE CISSNA  explained that this is unpaid  time and the                                                              
bill  specifies that  any additional  time  needed was  not to  be                                                              
paid by the employer.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
3:21:48 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES   indicated  that  this  language   is  only                                                              
acceptable to him  with the passage of the amendment  that removes                                                              
the penalty section of the bill.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
3:22:18 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE FAIRCLOUGH  suggested that there should  be a limit                                                              
to  the  number  of  months  or   years  that  an  employee  could                                                              
breastfeed,  in addition  to the  amount of time  taken each  day.                                                              
Also, she  cautioned about  the potential cost  to an  employer to                                                              
provide an  appropriate location  in close  proximity to  the work                                                              
space.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
3:24:34 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  CISSNA  pointed out  that  the bill  stipulates  a                                                              
location  "other than  a toilet  stall" which  does not exclude  a                                                              
bathroom   and  provides   some  flexibility   to  the   employer.                                                              
Regarding the  length of  time for the  mother to breastfeed,  the                                                              
first six  months of a baby's  life provide the  highest benefits.                                                              
However, the  bill allows  for an  interactive process  between an                                                              
employer and  an employee to address  these issues and  to build a                                                              
strong work environment.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
3:26:37 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE FAIRCLOUGH  agreed that families and  the health of                                                              
children always come  first.  She related her  personal experience                                                              
in  employing nursing  mothers as  a non-profit  employer and  the                                                              
problems with  limited space.   Accommodating employees is  a team                                                              
effort, but  one size does  not fit all,  thus the  requirement of                                                              
providing space  would be a cost  to an employer to  implement the                                                              
bill.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
3:28:34 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON questioned  whether the language in  the bill ensures                                                              
fair treatment to an employer who has limited space.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
3:29:51 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE CISSNA  directed the committee's attention  to page                                                              
1, line  10, which  read:   "(b) Unless  to do  so would create  a                                                              
substantial  and  undue  hardship  on the  employer,  ...."    She                                                              
acknowledged that in  the case of an employee who  works in a one-                                                              
room  office,  nursing  in  the  workplace would  not  be  a  good                                                              
choice.    The intent of the  bill is to invite Alaskans  to begin                                                              
building on all of the possibilities to promote good health.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
3:31:02 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES  pointed   out  that  the  "undue  hardship"                                                              
clause of  the bill allows for  the consideration of the  size and                                                              
situation  of  the  employer.    The  penalty  clauses  are  being                                                              
removed,   and  the   statement  of   reasonableness  covers   his                                                              
concerns.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
3:31:53 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER agreed with Representative Roses.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
3:32:06 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SEATON asked  whether  the  term "undue  hardship"                                                              
corresponds with  the American Disabilities Act  (ADA) definition.                                                              
He noted  that the  ADA definition requires  a very  high standard                                                              
of modification  to a workplace  and a  challenge to the  bill may                                                              
require a  court interpretation.   If the  definition in  the bill                                                              
does not  follow the ADA  standard he said  that he  would support                                                              
the bill.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
3:33:19 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  CISSNA  read page  2,  line 7  through  9, of  the                                                              
bill.    She  opined  that  the   definitions  "don't  sound  like                                                              
definitions that would come with physical disabilities."                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
3:34:03 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON  disagreed and said that the  ADA definition                                                              
has broad implications  for employers.  Furthermore,  he asked for                                                              
the meaning of "sanitary room" on page 1, line 11, of the bill.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
3:34:50 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  CISSNA  responded  that  a "sanitary  room"  is  a                                                              
reasonably  clean  room  with  a  sink and  with  soap  and  water                                                              
available.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
3:35:24 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SEATON  observed  that  those  requirements  would                                                              
disqualify a private  office.  He suggested that  the expectations                                                              
of a "sanitary room" need to be on the record.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
3:36:15 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE CISSNA  stressed that  the sponsor's intent  was to                                                              
provide  an appropriately  clean  room,  with or  without  running                                                              
water.  In a rural setting, employers may need to be creative.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
3:37:03 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES   advised  that  a  food   handler's  permit                                                              
requires a  sanitary station which  can be as simple  as providing                                                              
disinfectant  wipes.     As  far  as  the  ADA   requirements  are                                                              
concerned, a lactating mother is not disabled.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
3:38:17 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SEATON acknowledged  that was  not his point;  but                                                              
it  is important  to provide  the source  of the  definition.   He                                                              
assumed  that an  individual bathroom  would  be acceptable  under                                                              
some circumstances.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
3:39:20 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  CISSNA agreed  and suggested  that a more  general                                                              
definition in the bill would be better.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
3:40:00 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER commented  that she  was shocked  that her                                                              
daughter  was  nursing  in  a  bathroom  at  her  work  until  her                                                              
daughter  said,   "Oh,  it's  great,  there's  a   big  chair  and                                                              
counters."    Representative  Gardner opined  that  an  acceptable                                                              
room cannot  be unsanitary,  such as a  mop closet or  room filled                                                              
with fish guts, but not necessarily sterile, either.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
3:40:51 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
GREY  MITCHELL,  Director,  Central   Office,  Division  of  Labor                                                              
Standards &  Safety, Department  of Labor & Workforce  Development                                                              
(DLWD),  said that  having the penalty  aspect  of HB 190  removed                                                              
solves many potential problems with the bill.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
3:42:14 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON  asked whether the definition  of "employer"                                                              
found on page 2,  line 4, generally fits with definitions  used by                                                              
the DLWD.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR. MITCHELL said  that some definitions require  a certain number                                                              
of  employees.   He opined  that  this language  appears  to be  a                                                              
broad definition  and to encompass  all employers, except  for the                                                              
federal government.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
3:43:18 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON asked whether the language fits the ADA standards.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MR. MITCHELL said that he did not know.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
3:43:39 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   SEATON  asked  how   the  DLWD  would   interpret                                                              
"sanitary room" for enforcement purposes.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR. MITCHELL explained  that bringing clarity to the  term at this                                                              
time  would be  helpful, otherwise  provisions of  case law  would                                                              
need to be researched to determine the meaning.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
3:44:55 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SEATON asked  whether  the  discussion during  the                                                              
hearing today had provided ample clarity for the term.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MR.  MITCHELL  stated  that the  comment  made  by  Representative                                                              
Gardner made the interpretation fairly clear.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
3:45:34 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  WILSON  added   that  there  are  many   women  working  in                                                              
construction, with  portable bathrooms, and no  appropriate areas.                                                              
She  suggested "a  sanitary  room,  much like  found  in a  normal                                                              
household."                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
3:46:17 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  CISSNA recommended  "a not  unsanitary room."   On                                                              
the  other hand,  a  mother  may be  using  a vehicle  or  another                                                              
creative solution.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
3:47:06 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER advised  that a sanitary  room is  a place                                                              
where one is comfortable eating lunch.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
3:47:25 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES opined  that  using a  personal standard  of                                                              
home  conditions  may  not  be   the  right  approach,  given  the                                                              
variables  of   acceptability.    The   intent  of  the   bill  is                                                              
relatively clear  and he  stated that he  is comfortable  with the                                                              
existing language.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
3:48:44 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CATHERINE  TAPEY,   President,  Alaska  Breastfeeding   Coalition,                                                              
stated  her  support for  HB  190,  paraphrasing from  a  prepared                                                              
statement  which read  as follows  [original punctuation  provided                                                              
see packet]:                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     The  Alaska Breastfeeding  Coalition  supports bills  SB
     113  and HB  190, an  act relating  to  break times  for                                                                   
     employees who  nurse a child.  As professionals,  we see                                                                   
     on a daily  basis the dilemma of mothers  as they return                                                                   
     to  work.   We  know  that  many women  choose  to  quit                                                                   
     breastfeeding  sooner than  they would  like due to  the                                                                   
     difficulty  they  experience   when  trying  to  express                                                                   
     their milk for their child during their work schedule.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     The passage  of bills  SB 113 and  HB 190 will  not only                                                                   
     benefit  breastfeeding mothers  and  their infants,  but                                                                   
     employers as  well.  Breastfed babies  generally develop                                                                   
     fewer occurrences  of ear infections,  lower respiratory                                                                   
     infections,   and  GI  illnesses   during  infancy   and                                                                   
     childhood.   This  translates into  fewer absences  from                                                                   
     work  by the parent.   In  addition, healthier  children                                                                   
     have fewer doctor visits reducing health care costs.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     As stated  in a  letter to  the Editor  of the New  York                                                                   
     Times  by  Dr. Audrey  Naylor,  "A  goal of  the  United                                                                   
     States  Breastfeeding Committee  is  that 'every  woman,                                                                   
     regardless  of  her  employment status,  will  have  the                                                                   
     opportunity  to provide  breast  milk  for her  child.'"                                                                   
     By  showing  support  for SB  113  and  HB 190  you  can                                                                   
     protect  breastfeeding mothers  from discrimination  and                                                                   
     support  their  efforts to  raise  healthy babies.    We                                                                   
     find this legislation  to be a step forward  in reaching                                                                   
     that goal.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
3:50:46 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DEBRA  GOLDEN, Nurse  Consultant,  Section  of Women,  Children  &                                                              
Family Health, Division  of Public Health, Department  of Health &                                                              
Social Services,  stated her support  for HB 190,  concurring with                                                              
the   presentation  by   Representative  Cissna's   staff.     She                                                              
highlighted the  most applicable points previously  made and cited                                                              
statistics regarding  the health of breastfed babies,  provided by                                                              
the Oregon Department of Human Services.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
3:54:52 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES  asked  whether  Ms.  Golden  was  a  public                                                              
health nurse.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MS. GOLDEN  answered that  she was  a public  health nurse  in the                                                              
past, but  she now  is a para-natal  nurse consultant  working for                                                              
the Division of Public Health.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES  asked Ms.  Golden whether the  committee had                                                              
completely  discussed  the  possibilities  of what  constitutes  a                                                              
private and sanitary room.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MS.  GOLDEN agreed  that the  issue  had been  well discussed  and                                                              
said that  she was  comfortable with  language that described  the                                                              
space  for nursing  as  a home-like  environment;  clean, but  not                                                              
sterile.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
3:56:37 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER   asked  for  information   regarding  the                                                              
average time that working women breastfeed.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MS. GOLDEN opined  that about 10 percent of women  will breastfeed                                                              
beyond  one year.   In addition,  women  who do not  work or  work                                                              
part-time, breastfeed longer than those who work.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
3:58:47 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER  observed that  it would be  reasonable for                                                              
an employer to  expect that an employee may breastfeed  or express                                                              
milk for one year or less.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MS.  GOLDEN   agreed  and  added   that  the  majority   of  women                                                              
breastfeed  for   six  months.    She  noted   that  some  medical                                                              
organizations recommend breastfeeding beyond twelve months.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON  opined that  any amount of  time breastfeeding  is a                                                              
benefit.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MS. GOLDEN  agreed that breastfeeding  is important to  the infant                                                              
"early on."                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:01:06 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ERIN MACARTHUR,  Pediatrician; Board Member,  Alaska Breastfeeding                                                              
Coalition, stated  her support  for HB 190.   She pointed  out the                                                              
preventative effects  of breastfeeding on obesity  and stated that                                                              
obesity  is  a   critical  problem  in  Alaska.     Dr.  MacArthur                                                              
clarified that  a mother needs  to express  milk at work  in order                                                              
to keep a sufficient  supply of milk for the growing  needs of her                                                              
infant.  As a  child approaches one year in age,  the mother would                                                              
need less time at work to express milk.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:05:08 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  FAIRCLOUGH  asked Dr.  MacArthur  to estimate  how                                                              
much  time is  necessary to  require an  employer to  allow for  a                                                              
nursing mother.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
DR.  MACARTHUR opined  that a  lunch  break and  two other  breaks                                                              
would be adequate  as most mothers need 15 to 20  minutes of time.                                                              
However, the  comfort level for  nursing or expressing  milk plays                                                              
a part in the length of time needed.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
4:07:31 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE FAIRCLOUGH asked for clarification.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
DR. MACARTHUR said three times per day is needed.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
4:07:45 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  WILSON  asked  whether three  times  during  an  eight-hour                                                              
shift is sufficient.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
DR. MACARTHUR  said,  "Allowing it  every three  to four hours  is                                                              
probably the better way to say it."                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
4:08:02 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON  surmised that,  normally, workers  have a  15 minute                                                              
break in the morning and afternoon, and a lunch hour.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
DR.  MACARTHUR  noted that  this  schedule  should work  for  most                                                              
mothers.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:08:30 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
COLLEEN TURNER,  Executive Director,  Resource Center  for Parents                                                              
and Children,  paraphrased from  a prepared statement,  which read                                                              
as follows [original punctuation provided]:                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     Our  mission  is  [to]  create  a  culture  that  values                                                                   
     parenting and  keeping children safe.   I am  here today                                                                   
     to talk  with you about  HB 190 and  my support  for the                                                                   
     bill.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     It is  unfortunate a bill  such as  this is needed.   It                                                                   
     only  seems natural  that breastfeeding  mothers  should                                                                   
     be afforded  whatever is needed  to make the  experience                                                                   
     the  best possible  for the  mother and  child.  I  have                                                                   
     been  a business  leader in  the community  for over  20                                                                   
     years, seven  at the Resource Center.  During  that time                                                                   
     we have  had half  a dozen women  who have had  newborns                                                                   
     and  chosen  to  nurse  their babies.    Again  it  only                                                                   
     seemed  natural to  do everything  we could  do to  make                                                                   
     the experience a successful one.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     Because  we  recognize  the value  of  breastfeeding  we                                                                   
     adopted  policies  that  allow mothers  to  bring  their                                                                   
     children to work  up until one year of age,  if nursing.                                                                   
     This practice  kept valuable employees in  the workforce                                                                   
     longer,  and strengthened  the  mother/child  bond.   We                                                                   
     have  been  able  to  provide  quiet,  clean  places  to                                                                   
     nurse.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:10:08 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DEADRA HALL,  informed the  committee that she  was a  nursing mom                                                              
and stated  her support  for HB 190.   She is  a state  worker and                                                              
also works  for Local  52.  In  her situation,  she drives  to her                                                              
child's daycare in  order to nurse at lunch.   Having a permanent,                                                              
designated  place to  nurse at  work, and  encouragement from  her                                                              
employer, would enable  her child to be brought to  her.  Ms. Hall                                                              
said that there are five nursing mothers in her department                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
4:12:10 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON asked Ms. Hall what type of work she does.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MS. HALL  said that  she is  an office  worker.   She opined  that                                                              
time  for  nursing  mothers  does  not place  a  hardship  on  her                                                              
employer; nevertheless, providing a space is difficult.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON asked about Ms. Hall's schedule.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MS.  HALL  said that  she  expresses  her  milk twice  and  drives                                                              
across town to nurse at lunch.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
4:13:31 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER  asked   how  long  working  mothers  have                                                              
continued to nurse.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
MS. HALL  related that one  co-worker stopped after  three months,                                                              
because she  was uncomfortable with  the arrangements,  and others                                                              
continue for three to five months.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
4:14:47 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON asked how long Ms. Hall plans to continue.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MS. HALL said that she wished to nurse for at least a year.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:15:23 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  CISSNA asked  how  Ms. Hall's  employer reacts  to                                                              
nursing mothers.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MS. HALL stated  that her employer is receptive and  is willing to                                                              
work with the mothers.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
4:16:44 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
WILLIE ANDERSON,  Lobbyist, National Education  Association-Alaska                                                              
(NEA -  Alaska), described  the  support within  NEA - Alaska  for                                                              
this bill and characterized  it as a strong pro-family  bill.  Mr.                                                              
Anderson pointed  out that the NEA  - Alaska health plan  offers a                                                              
pump benefit  as part of its  commitment to support  breastfeeding                                                              
mothers.  He urged members to pass the bill out of committee.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
4:18:37 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON asked  whether the teacher's lounge  is an acceptable                                                              
area for nursing mothers.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR.  ANDERSON  said  that  prior  negotiations  have  been  for  a                                                              
separate and private area, such as the nurse's office.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
4:19:09 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES  asked whether  negotiations  have  included                                                              
additional  time, for teachers  who are  nursing, beyond  planning                                                              
time and lunch breaks.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MR. ANDERSON  explained that  negotiations  are on a  case-by-case                                                              
basis with  the teacher  and the  school principal and  additional                                                              
time, beyond breaks, lunch and planning, has not been requested.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
4:20:36 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES further  asked whether  the passage  of this                                                              
bill would change what has been negotiated thus far.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MR.  ANDERSON indicated  that  a change  was  not anticipated;  in                                                              
fact, trying  to find time away  from the classroom for  a teacher                                                              
was always difficult.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES  agreed that it  can be difficult  and costly                                                              
to find coverage  for a classroom; the potential  ramifications of                                                              
this bill are unknown.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
4:22:44 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON  warned that  finding a private  place for  a nursing                                                              
mother  would  be  very  difficult   in  some  schools;  in  fact,                                                              
sometimes  the  nurse  is  working  in the  hallway.    She  asked                                                              
whether  providing   a  substitute  teacher  would   be  an  undue                                                              
hardship for a school.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MR. ANDERSON  stressed that the  times allowed by the  language in                                                              
the  proposed bill  are  sufficient.   He  gave an  example of  an                                                              
appropriate space that was provided for a teacher.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  WILSON expressed  her concern  that  cooperation would  not                                                              
always prevent lawsuits.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:25:09 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SEATON recalled that  Alaska has existing  statute                                                              
that  ensures that  women  can  legally breastfeed  anywhere  they                                                              
like,  including in  a teacher's  lounge.   He  asked whether  the                                                              
bill was necessary to provide for expressing milk.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
4:26:27 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. ANDERSON explained that using the teacher's lounge was a                                                                    
modesty, not a legal, issue.  The existing law does allow                                                                       
mothers to breastfeed.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
4:27:33 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER opined that there was a distinction                                                                      
between breastfeeding, which can be discreet, or expressing.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
4:27:56 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON closed public testimony.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
4:28:19 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE CISSNA offered Amendment 1, which read:                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     Page 1, line 14, through page 2, line 2:                                                                                   
          Delete all material.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     Page 2, line 3:                                                                                                            
          Delete "(d)"                                                                                                          
          Insert "(c)"                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE CISSNA explained that this amendment removes any                                                                 
type of sanction against an employer who does not meet the                                                                      
requirements of the bill.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
4:29:30 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
There being no objection, Amendment 1 was adopted.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
4:29:44 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES offered Amendment 2, which read:                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     Page 1, line 11:                                                                                                           
          Delete ", secure,"                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
There being no objection, Amendment 2 was adopted.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
4:30:42 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  FAIRCLOUGH offered  Conceptual  Amendment 3,  such                                                              
that on page  1, line 5, after  "unpaid break time",  the language                                                              
"not to exceed three times" would be inserted.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES objected for discussion.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
4:31:45 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  FAIRCLOUGH explained that  the amendment  sets the                                                              
parameter  so an employer  would  know that this  is unpaid  break                                                              
time that fits into a regularly scheduled work day.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
4:32:23 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES removed his objection.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
There  being no  further  objection,  Conceptual  Amendment 3  was                                                              
adopted.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:32:34 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE FAIRCLOUGH  offered Amendment 4, such  that on page                                                              
1, line  5, after "nursing  mother of a  child" insert "up  to six                                                              
months of age."                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES objected.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE FAIRCLOUGH  explained that this  amendment provides                                                              
the employer  with an  expectation of  the length  of time  that a                                                              
new mother may nurse or express milk.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
4:33:21 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON  suggested that the  language provided by  Ms. Golden                                                              
was appropriate.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  FAIRCLOUGH re-stated that  this gives  an employer                                                              
a specific time limit for the accommodation.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
4:34:08 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER  opined   that  this  bill  would  make  a                                                              
statement  of support  for a  practice that  would provide  health                                                              
benefits; therefore, a time limit does not seem appropriate.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
4:34:41 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON  pointed out  that nothing in  the amendment                                                              
requires the  employer or  employee to stop  the practice  after a                                                              
certain  period  of  time;  it just  limits  the  mandate  on  the                                                              
employer to  provide accommodations.   He  then asked  whether the                                                              
amendment specifies six months or one year.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON answered six months.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
4:35:46 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE CISSNA  suggested "no more than one  year or twelve                                                              
months."                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:36:11 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   FAIRCLOUGH  stated   that  the   intent  of   the                                                              
amendment is  to limit the employer's  exposure.  She  opined that                                                              
a   change   in  labor   practice   in   the  state   to   require                                                              
accommodations  for  nursing  mothers  would  need  more  specific                                                              
guidelines  for  employers,  so   employers  could  determine  the                                                              
fiscal impact.   Representative Fairclough  said that she  was not                                                              
opposed to a limit of twelve months.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
4:37:45 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SEATON offered  Amendment 1  to Amendment  4, such                                                              
that "six" was changed to "twelve."                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
There  being  no  objection,  Amendment   1  to  Amendment  4  was                                                              
adopted.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES removed his objection to Amendment 4.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Hearing  no  further  objection,  Amendment  4,  as  amended,  was                                                              
adopted.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:38:19 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON  asked about  the difference between  HB 190  and the                                                              
existing Alaska statute that says mothers can nurse in public.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
4:38:51 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  CISSNA explained  that  the  current statute  does                                                              
not specify  the work  place.   She then  advised that  the Center                                                              
for  Disease  Control  (CDC)  held   a  teleconference  concerning                                                              
overweight  children   and  revealed  that  breastfeeding   is  an                                                              
important preventative  step.   In fact,  the CDC is  implementing                                                              
training tools for  states to work on ways to  minimize the impact                                                              
on  businesses and  enable  employers to  address  this issue  and                                                              
support  improved  health  across   the  nation.    Representative                                                              
Cissna   encouraged   Representative   Fairclough's   attempt   to                                                              
strengthen the bill from the employer's perspective.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
4:41:11 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   ROSES  further   explained   that  the   existing                                                              
statutes were enacted  to prevent a woman from  being charged with                                                              
indecent exposure  while breastfeeding in public.   House Bill 190                                                              
requires an  employer to  provide a place  and an opportunity  for                                                              
an employee to breastfeed at her workplace.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:41:45 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE FAIRCLOUGH offered Amendment 5, as follows:                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     Page 1, line 10 and 11;                                                                                                    
          Delete "(b) Unless to do so would create a                                                                            
     substantial and undue hardship on the employer,"                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     Page 1, line 11, following "employer shall."                                                                               
          Capitalize "An"                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     Page 2                                                                                                                     
          Delete lines 7-9                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES objected.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   FAIRCLOUGH  recalled   the  difficulty   defining                                                              
"undue  hardship"   and  the  possible  conflict   with  the  ADA.                                                              
Amendments  5 and  6 would  eliminate the  subjective language  of                                                              
the bill.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES asked for a reading of the Amendment.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
4:43:21 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  FAIRCLOUGH  modified  Amendment  5 to  include  on                                                              
page  1,  line  11,  after  the   word  "shall",  insert  "make  a                                                              
reasonable attempt  to."  She  concluded that the  amendment would                                                              
eliminate  the possible  problem  with the  ADA and  use the  word                                                              
"reasonable," which is a term already defined in law.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
4:44:22 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER  asked whether  "reasonable"  can  include                                                              
factors  such  as   the  size  of  the  business,   its  financial                                                              
resources,  and the nature  and structure  of its environment,  so                                                              
that the expectation of different businesses can be appropriate.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   FAIRCLOUGH  opined   that  "reasonable"   can  be                                                              
accommodating  to different  situations.   She cited the  language                                                              
used in  New York is "employers  must allow breastfeeding  mothers                                                              
reasonable  unpaid  break times  to  express milk  and  to make  a                                                              
reasonable attempt to provide a private location."                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
4:46:11 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER stressed  that "reasonable" also  includes                                                              
financial aspects and a variety of factors.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  FAIRCLOUGH  clarified that  "reasonable"  includes                                                              
modifications  that might  be required  and cause  expense to  the                                                              
employer to provide accommodations to the mother.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
4:46:48 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES removed his objection.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Hearing  no  further  objection,  Amendment 5  [as  modified]  was                                                              
adopted.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:47:44 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER  moved to report SSHB 190,  as amended, out                                                              
of   committee    with   individual   recommendations    and   the                                                              
accompanying  fiscal  notes.   There  being no  objection,  CSSSHB
190(HES)  was moved  out the  House Health,  Education and  Social                                                              
Services Standing Committee                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
HB 397-POSTSECONDARY SCHOLARSHIPS                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
[Contains discussion of HB 403.]                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
4:48:01 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON  announced that the  next order of business  would be                                                              
HOUSE BILL NO.  397, "An Act creating a  postsecondary scholarship                                                              
grant program for  Alaska residents based on high  achievement and                                                              
financial need."                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
[Testimony   was  heard   on   HOUSE  BILL   NO.   403,  "An   Act                                                              
appropriating  $100,000,000 to the  Alaska achievers'  scholarship                                                              
fund;  and providing  for an  effective date,"  although the  bill                                                              
was not formally before the committee.]                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:48:56 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   DAVID  GUTTENBERG,   Alaska  State   Legislature,                                                              
introduced  HB  397,  as  the prime  sponsor.    He  informed  the                                                              
committee  that  the  bill  establishes  an endowment  to  fund  a                                                              
combination  needs-based   and  merit-based   college  scholarship                                                              
program.    Representative  Guttenberg  pointed  out  that  Alaska                                                              
ranks last  in the  U. S.  in supplying  this type of  scholarship                                                              
and  it  was  a critical  aspect  of  the  legislature  to  assist                                                              
residents with the ability to go to college.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
4:50:54 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
WILLIAM ANDREWS,  Member, Board of Regents, University  of Alaska;                                                              
Student, University  of Alaska Southeast,  stated his  support for                                                              
HB 397  and HB 403.   Through  his experience as  a member  of the                                                              
Board  of  Regents  and  as  a  former  legislative  staffer,  Mr.                                                              
Andrews realized  the importance  of the services  the legislature                                                              
provides  to  the residents  of  the  state.   Furthermore,  as  a                                                              
student,  he  realized  that  there is  a  growing  population  of                                                              
students  falling through  the cracks  due to  their inability  to                                                              
meet the cost of  tuition.  These bills would help  bridge the gap                                                              
for students who  can not afford to continue at  the University of                                                              
Alaska (UA).  He  opined that there was a discrepancy  between the                                                              
affluence  of the  state  and the  lack  of scholarship  programs.                                                              
Existing  scholarship  programs  are  not  increased  with  rising                                                              
costs,  and  students  who need  scholarships  to  complete  their                                                              
educations  are disenfranchised.   Mr. Andrews  advocated  for the                                                              
need to  support students  who have the  potential to  develop the                                                              
Alaska work  force.  He concluded  that the accountability  aspect                                                              
of this fund  requires successful academic performance,  on behalf                                                              
of the student, to continue to receive financial aid.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
4:55:57 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES   asked  how  Mr.  Andrews   is  paying  for                                                              
college.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MR.  ANDREWS  stated  that he  is  receiving  scholarship  funding                                                              
through various  Native corporations.   In  addition, he  receives                                                              
about  $300  per   month  through  the  G.  I.   bill,  and  found                                                              
additional funding  through the Preparing Indigenous  Teachers and                                                              
Administrators for Alaska's Schools (PITAAS) scholarship.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
4:57:56 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES recounted  his college experience  attending                                                              
a  private  school, and  how  he  paid  for  his education.    The                                                              
education  was dear  to  him because  he had  to  pay every  cent;                                                              
however,  some students  do not  take  personal responsibility  in                                                              
paying for  their educations.   Representative  Roses pointed  out                                                              
that  students today  have  scholarships  and the  Permanent  Fund                                                              
Dividend (PFD) to help pay for college.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
5:00:11 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. ANDREWS noted  that his PFD was not available  to him until he                                                              
was 18  years of age.   He agreed that  it is a resource  now, but                                                              
should not  be considered as an  entitlement available to  pay for                                                              
college  into  the  future.    Furthermore,  he  opined  that  the                                                              
availability  of the PFD  has accounted for  raises in  tuition at                                                              
the UA.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
5:02:15 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DIANE   BARRANS,  Executive   Director,  Postsecondary   Education                                                              
Commission,  Department   of  Education  and   Early  Development,                                                              
informed  the committee  that there  was  a clear  unmet need  for                                                              
needs-based  aid for students.   The  additional element  of merit                                                              
is  laudable; however,  the goal  of  the Postsecondary  Education                                                              
Commission is  to assist those with  the greatest need.   She said                                                              
that  these  funds  would  be  administered  in  conjunction  with                                                              
existing  programs and  indicated that  there would  be a  sizable                                                              
demand for the scholarships.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
5:03:40 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  CISSNA  recalled that  Alaska  ranks  last in  the                                                              
achievement  of bachelor's  degrees.   She  asked  Ms. Barrans  to                                                              
comment.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
5:04:52 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS.  BARRANS stated  that incentives  and information  need to  be                                                              
provided  to students and  their families.   Academic  preparation                                                              
and ability,  and the  ability to  pay tuition,  are critical  for                                                              
students  to successfully  complete  their  studies  and obtain  a                                                              
degree.    In Alaska,  fewer  than  one  in six  college  students                                                              
complete their  higher education in  a timely manner,  one barrier                                                              
being the accumulated debt.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
5:06:53 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SEATON asked whether  there should  be a  limit on                                                              
the number of years an applicant was eligible for a scholarship.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MS.  BARRANS  advised  that  amendments   have  been  prepared  to                                                              
address this issue.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
5:07:56 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES   asked  whether  Ms.  Barrans'   office  is                                                              
responsible  for  managing  the  portion  of PFD  funds  that  are                                                              
dedicated for college.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MS. BARRANS  said no.   The PFD allotment  is managed  through the                                                              
UA.                                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
5:08:34 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES expressed  his interest  in how many  people                                                              
choose to dedicate  funds for education.  This  is another example                                                              
of removing an  individual's responsibility to provide  for his or                                                              
her education.   He  then asked  whether there is  a limit  in the                                                              
amount  of  student loans  given  per  year by  the  Postsecondary                                                              
Education Commission.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
5:09:33 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS.  BARRANS  said that  the  limit,  per  student, per  year,  is                                                              
$8,500.  The total loan volume last year was $85 million.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES further asked  whether there were  qualified                                                              
students who did not receive funds.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
MS.  BARRANS recalled  that  qualified  applicants  have not  been                                                              
denied funds since 1987.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES observed  that an  applicant that  qualifies                                                              
for this scholarship would also qualify for a student loan.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MS.  BARRANS explained  that all  of  the students  would need  to                                                              
combine  grant aid  with  loans  from various  sources.   A  small                                                              
minority of  students would  be able to  pay for their  education,                                                              
which  costs  about $17,000  per  year  at a  public  institution,                                                              
solely with grants or scholarships.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
The committee took an at-ease from 5:10:48 PM to 5:11:46 PM.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
5:11:51 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON explained the procedure for public testimony.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
5:13:00 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES  opined that the bill allows  scholarships to                                                              
"qualifying  postsecondary  institutions  in  the state"  and  may                                                              
apply  to students  attending  trade  and vocational  schools,  or                                                              
working under an apprenticeship.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
5:13:42 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS.  BARRANS clarified  that  the  eligible institutions  must  be                                                              
regionally or nationally accredited, and located in Alaska.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
5:14:16 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   GARDNER  asked   whether  union   apprenticeships                                                              
charge tuition.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MS. BARRANS opined that they do not.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
5:14:49 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON asked for a list of the qualified schools.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
5:15:08 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ANNAMARIA  DICOLA,  Student,  University  of  Alaska,  stated  her                                                              
support for HB 397 and HB 403.  She pointed out that the non-                                                                   
traditional students  in Homer are  focused on career  development                                                              
and this program would help to meet the state's workforce need.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
5:16:39 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JOHN  ROBERSON   III,  Student   Body  President,  University   of                                                              
Anchorage, asked  for the committee's  help in assisting  Alaskans                                                              
to  achieve  their  academic  goals.     He  recalled  the  recent                                                              
legislation  to give incentives  to outside  businesses that  come                                                              
to Alaska;  in fact, HB 397 and  HB 403 would give  incentives for                                                              
students  to stay  in Alaska  and improve  the state's  workforce.                                                              
Mr. Roberson  stressed the importance  of keeping students  in the                                                              
state so that they will stay and work here.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
5:18:57 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
RYAN BUCHHOLDT,  Student, University  of Alaska Anchorage,  stated                                                              
his support  for HB 397  and HB 403  and echoed the  sentiments of                                                              
the previous  witness.   To pay  for school  he works a  full-time                                                              
job  and  lives  with  family.   Mr.  Bucholdt  opined  that  this                                                              
incentive  would help  prevent future  students  from leaving  the                                                              
state.   In response  to questions  from Representative  Roses, he                                                              
said that he carried 12 credits and works full-time.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
5:20:43 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MISTY M.  GIL MARTINEZ, Student,  University of Alaska  Fairbanks,                                                              
stated  that she  is  a wife,  the mother  of  three, a  full-time                                                              
student,  and an  employee.   She reviewed  her highly  successful                                                              
high school  history and  stated that she  did not attend  college                                                              
due to financial  constraints.  Ten years later  she began college                                                              
to improve her  employment opportunities.  Ms.  Gil Martinez spoke                                                              
of   her  financial   difficulties   and   the  effect   full-time                                                              
employment  had on  her  grade point  average.    She opined  that                                                              
financial  aid relieves  stress  and  facilitates  learning.   She                                                              
concluded that funding  for education will improve  Alaska in many                                                              
ways.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
5:24:34 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MEREDITH  CAMERON,   Student,  University  of   Alaska  Fairbanks,                                                              
stated  her  support for  HB  397,  paraphrasing from  a  prepared                                                              
statement, which read as follows [original punctuation provided]                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     As   a  resident  of   Fairbanks,  a   student  of   the                                                                   
     University of  Alaska Fairbanks and an Alaskan,  I would                                                                   
     like  to express  my support  for  the Alaska  Achievers                                                                   
     Incentive  Program (AAIP)  [HB 397  and HB  403].   This                                                                   
     program    is   our   first    step   towards    college                                                                   
     affordability and increased student success.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     Higher  education  should  be  a  top  priority  to  our                                                                   
     state, as  we are  the future of  Alaska.  Through  this                                                                   
     program  those who have  the grades  and skills will  be                                                                   
     able  to   think  about  attending  University   without                                                                   
     needing to think  about the money.  For  graduating high                                                                   
     school  grads the  cost  of a  higher  education is  the                                                                   
     most important  topic discussed  by the student  and the                                                                   
     family.  It  is a shame that students do not  move on to                                                                   
     higher  learning because of  the cost.   The AAIP  looks                                                                   
     to provide assistance  to these students who  have a 3.0                                                                   
     High School GPA and meet financial aid standards.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     As  a Junior  here at  the  University of  Alaska and  a                                                                   
     high school  graduate of  West Valley,  I have seen  way                                                                   
     too  many of  my  fellow students  drop  out of  college                                                                   
     because  they cannot  afford  it.   They  did not  leave                                                                   
     because their  classes were too hard, or they  felt they                                                                   
     were  not getting a  steller education,  it was  because                                                                   
     they  could not  afford the  rising costs.   No  sutdent                                                                   
     should be  forced to work 40  hours a week  to stgruggle                                                                   
     to pay  for the  12 credits they  now are struggling  in                                                                   
     because they are too busy working.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     Our  students  of  Alaska  high  schools  deserve  more.                                                                   
     They  need to  know that  some [one]  out [there]  cares                                                                   
     and worries about  the rising cost of tuition.   We have                                                                   
     a  very  successful  merit  based  scholarship,  the  UA                                                                   
     Scholars, now  it is time for a needs  ased scholarship.                                                                   
     I  have never  seen  a group  of students  more  passion                                                                   
     [ate] about  a need.  Here  at the University  of Alaska                                                                   
     Fairbanks, the  Associated Students of UAF  have finally                                                                   
     stood  up and  demanded  an  equal opportunity  for  the                                                                   
     students of  Alaska.  There were many  sleepless nights,                                                                   
     pouring  over   thousands  of  pages  of   material  and                                                                   
     reports,   and  dialogue  with   students,  staff,   and                                                                   
     administrator.    In  the end  they  achieved  something                                                                   
     that they  were told was impossible.   A House  Bill No.                                                                   
     397  now   sits  in  committee   that  would   start  an                                                                   
     endowment to  provide scholarships on a merit  and needs                                                                   
     based system.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     The great state  of Alaska and the nation  thrive on our                                                                   
     higher  education  institutions.     The  University  of                                                                   
     Alaska engages  the community, provides a  skilled labor                                                                   
     force,  and builds  a stronger  state.   As your  voting                                                                   
     constituent I  urge [you] to please support  bill number                                                                   
     397 and open up the future of many young Alaskans.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
5:26:12 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER  asked whether Ms.  Cameron held a  job and                                                              
was working over spring break.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MS. CAMERON said yes.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
5:26:46 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE FAIRCLOUGH  asked all of the students  if they know                                                              
the source of the state grant money.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MS. CAMERON indicated that the money comes from oil.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  FAIRCLOUGH   explained  the  struggle   of  policy                                                              
makers who  must consider approving  benefits to some who  may not                                                              
support  the industry  that  provides 90  percent  of the  state's                                                              
revenue.  Conversations with  students have  indicated that  they,                                                              
and perhaps the  university system, do not support  development of                                                              
the Pebble Mine  or oil exploration in the Chukchi  Sea.  However,                                                              
she  pointed  out  that resource  development  is  the  source  of                                                              
income that  would fund this  $100 million grant.   Representative                                                              
Fairclough observed  that there should be support  for the revenue                                                              
stream from those who receive benefits.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
5:29:46 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON supported Representative Fairclough's point.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
5:30:01 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  CISSNA asked  whether the  students have  ideas on                                                              
how to diversify Alaska's source of revenue.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
5:30:51 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DAVID   CHILDERS,  Student,   University   of  Alaska   Anchorage,                                                              
remarked   that  students   in   Alaska  can   look  to   economic                                                              
opportunities, outside  of resource development, and  explore them                                                              
through the  university.   However; the  university does  not have                                                              
the capability  to provide  scholarships for needs-based  students                                                              
or to  compete with  other states  that provide  up to  $4,000 per                                                              
year to  support low income students.   The diversity  of Alaska's                                                              
economic base  may depend  on UA  graduates developing  the future                                                              
resources in technology, the Internet, or in construction.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES   asked  whether  the  $4,000   provided  to                                                              
students in other states is a grant or a loan.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MR.   CHILDERS   answered  that   the   Supplemental   Educational                                                              
Opportunity  Grant  funds  grants  in  the  amount  of  $2,000  to                                                              
$4,000.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
5:34:51 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES suggested  that the  state greatly  increase                                                              
the amount  of the student loan  program and add a  work incentive                                                              
for those who stay in the state.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR. CHILDERS opined  that the increased debt burden  would prevent                                                              
graduates from investing in their community for many years.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES advised  that a  loan program  would have  a                                                              
source  of  future  income  that may  support  the  program  after                                                              
declining oil revenues can not.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
5:37:09 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  KELLER noted  that funds  for the  program may  be                                                              
limited.   He  asked whether  the  preference would  be to  needs-                                                              
based, or merit-based, scholars in that case.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
5:37:55 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  CHILDERS  pointed  out  that   the  UA  Scholars  Program  is                                                              
available to  support students  on a merit  only basis.   However,                                                              
HB 397 incorporates  need-based and merit-based  qualifications in                                                              
a  sustainable  scholarship  endowment  system.    In  fact,  a  5                                                              
percent to  10 percent  investment return  on the endowment  would                                                              
mean $5 million to $10 million available for scholarships.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
5:39:16 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  KELLER surmised  that the  $100 million  endowment                                                              
would take care of the needs-based applicants.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MR. CHILDERS  related statistics  by the  financial aid  office at                                                              
the  University  of  Alaska  Anchorage   that  indicated  that  $3                                                              
million would  be sufficient to  allow UA Anchorage to  assist its                                                              
needs-based  applicants.    He further  opined  that  $10  million                                                              
would be sufficient for the statewide university system.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
5:40:35 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MARY GOWER,  Director, Enrollment  Services, University  of Alaska                                                              
Fairbanks, recalled  that Alaska is ranked 51st in  the nation for                                                              
supplying need-based  aid for  education.   She stressed  the need                                                              
for  additional need-based  grant  aid and  pointed  out that  the                                                              
existing  need-based programs  are  modest  programs with  limited                                                              
resources.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
5:41:56 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES  asked  Ms.  Gower for  the  average  yearly                                                              
enrollment of the statewide university system.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MS. GOWEN  indicated that  enrollment was  about 33,000  full-time                                                              
and part-time students.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES observed  that 5 percent  of the  endowment,                                                              
or about  $8 million, would only  help 1,600 of the  students each                                                              
year.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MS.   GOWAN  pointed   out  that   the   university  is   awarding                                                              
approximately $102  million in financial aid each  year, a portion                                                              
of which is loan  aid.  In addition, $13.1 million  is distributed                                                              
as need-based  grants  and students  continue to  drop out  due to                                                              
financial problems.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
5:43:47 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DELIGHT KENNEDY,  Student, University of Alaska  Fairbanks, stated                                                              
that she is representing  students from the past  and the present,                                                              
and from rural and  urban communities.  She pointed  out that only                                                              
twenty-seven  percent  of  enrollees  graduate in  six  years;  in                                                              
fact, the  highest percentage  drop out  for family and  financial                                                              
reasons.   Ms. Kennedy related  her personal experience  regarding                                                              
family financial  responsibilities.   She  continued to point  out                                                              
that  many   current  enrollees   are  working  full-time,   which                                                              
detracts from their  academic success, and the  existing financial                                                              
aid  programs are  inadequate.   For  example, at  her urban  high                                                              
school,  the  top 10  percent  of  the  class  had a  grade  point                                                              
average  of 4.2.   She  concluded  that an  investment in  Alaskan                                                              
students is an investment in Alaska.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
5:47:04 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHRISTOPHER   STEFANOVICH,    Student,   University    of   Alaska                                                              
Anchorage, provided  statistics that indicated how  an increase in                                                              
tuition  effects  enrollment at  the  university.   He  urged  the                                                              
committee to support the bills.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
5:49:02 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JAKE  HAMBURG,  President,  Student  Body,  University  of  Alaska                                                              
Fairbanks,  stated   that  he   was  representing  nine   thousand                                                              
students.  He  paraphrasing from a prepared statement,  which read                                                              
as follows [original punctuation provided]:                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     I  am  a University  of  Alaska  Fairbanks  student  who                                                                   
     began  his UA education  at Kenai  Peninsula College  in                                                                   
     Soldotna.   I work approximately  56 ours per  week both                                                                   
     as UAF's student  body president and as a  weekend sales                                                                   
     associate  while  also  attending  class  fulltime.    I                                                                   
     cannot afford  to work any less due to  rent, inevitable                                                                   
     car repairs,  fuel, tuition,  and books.   I do  not shy                                                                   
     away  from   hard  work  but   paying  for   my  college                                                                   
     education  is  increasingly  placing  a strain  upon  my                                                                   
     ability to successfully complete by degree.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     As  UAF's student  body president,  this  [is] a  common                                                                   
     experience I  hear from many of the students  and groups                                                                   
     that  I  have  met  with.   I  have  met  far  too  many                                                                   
     students who  have been forced to drop out  because they                                                                   
     could  not personally  fund  their  education.   I  know                                                                   
     from  speaking  with  many  other  students  around  the                                                                   
     state  that they  are working  long hours  to make  ends                                                                   
     meet  while trying  to also  finish  their homework  and                                                                   
     attend classes.   Students know how important  a college                                                                   
     education   is  to  their   future  and  so   they  work                                                                   
     incredible hours and burden themselves with debt.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     The  state  of  Alaska's  employers   are  craving  more                                                                   
     university  graduates and  addressing the  affordability                                                                   
     issues plaguing  students and  their families will  go a                                                                   
     long  way  toward  meeting  that need.    We  know  from                                                                   
     existing research  that a $1,000  reduction in  the cost                                                                   
     of  a college  education can  boost  enrollment by  nine                                                                   
     percent.   We  also know  that  a $160  increase in  the                                                                   
     cost  of attendance  can drop  undergraduate  enrollment                                                                   
     by .5  percent and community  college enrollment  by 2.3                                                                   
     percent.    A  survey performed  by  the  University  of                                                                   
     Alaska Southeast  found that  the number two  reason why                                                                   
     students  were dropping  out was  because they  couldn't                                                                   
     afford  to continue  their  education.   The number  one                                                                   
     reason was family problems.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     For students  approaching their high school  graduation,                                                                   
     the cost  of a  higher education  is the most  important                                                                   
     topic discussed  by the student  and the family.   It is                                                                   
     unfortunate  that  students do  not  move on  to  higher                                                                   
     learning because of the cost.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     It  has also  been shown  that  the growing  cost of  an                                                                   
     education  is changing the  perception of  affordability                                                                   
     among  our elementary  and  middle school  students  and                                                                   
     their  parents.   It  is  at  these ages  that  students                                                                   
     really  decide whether college  is something  attainable                                                                   
     for themselves.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
     There is  some good new.   The state has  an opportunity                                                                   
     to   support    a   student-led   effort    to   provide                                                                   
     scholarships   to   those   students   who   demonstrate                                                                   
     academic merit  and financial need.  In the  interest of                                                                   
     thousands of  students from all ages and  regions around                                                                   
     this  state,  it  is  my  sincere  hope  that  you  will                                                                   
     support HB 397 and HB 403.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
5:50:12 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CASEY MELIAH,  Student, University  of Alaska Anchorage,  informed                                                              
the committee that  he is a freshman enrolled at  UA Anchorage and                                                              
HB 397  and HB 403  would allow him  to better pursue  his studies                                                              
to be  a firefighter  and paramedic.   He  explained that  he will                                                              
need to  exceed the  recommended 20  hour work  week to  cover his                                                              
college expenses.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
5:51:48 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON asked  whether Mr. Meliah plans to stay  in Alaska to                                                              
work.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR. MELIAH said yes.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
5:52:16 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DANIEL   SWISHER,  Student,   University   of  Alaska   Fairbanks,                                                              
expressed  his concern  that the  committee was  unaware that  the                                                              
cost of  tuition is  just one part  of the  cost of an  education.                                                              
He noted  that fees are rising  as fast, or faster,  than tuition.                                                              
Mr.  Swisher opined  that the  bill  proposes a  one time  funding                                                              
that will be  sustained as an endowment.  Furthermore,  the return                                                              
on the  endowment would  fit with the  other existing  programs to                                                              
assist students.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
5:54:01 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  WILSON  thanked those  who  have  been waiting  to  testify                                                              
since 3:00 p.m.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
5:54:35 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SETH HOLTSHOUSER,  Student, University  of Alaska Anchorage,  said                                                              
that he  is a  life-long Alaskan.   He  expressed his belief  that                                                              
individual   responsibility   is   the   same   as   the   state's                                                              
responsibility  to develop  and cultivate  future human  resources                                                              
through  its  own  citizens.    The  Alaska  Achievers'  Incentive                                                              
Scholarship  Program  [(AAIP)]  endorses  the investment  and  the                                                              
economic development  of Alaska's workforce in future  leaders and                                                              
provides Alaskans  greater access to the training,  education, and                                                              
resources of  the universities across  Alaska.  He  encouraged the                                                              
state's policy  makers to  join other  states in placing  economic                                                              
access to  education as  the top  priority and responsibility  for                                                              
its citizens.   Mr. Holtshouser  concluded that this program  is a                                                              
crucial  point  in addressing  student's  needs,  now  and in  the                                                              
future, and to make a positive impact on the state.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
5:56:44 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES  asked whether Mr. Holtshouser  saved his PFD                                                              
for college.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
5:56:58 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. HOLTSHOUSER noted  that, after the age of 18,  he chose to use                                                              
his PFD to offset  student loans.  In response to  a question, Mr.                                                              
Holtshouser said that he was a sophomore.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
5:59:08 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JOSEPH  HICKMAN, Director,  Student  Support Services,  University                                                              
of  Alaska Fairbanks  (UAF), explained  that he  was a  low-income                                                              
and high  achieving  student at  UAF.  Although  he qualified  for                                                              
many  scholarship  and loan  programs,  and worked  full-time,  he                                                              
graduated  with $50,000  of student  loan  debt.   He opined  that                                                              
this bill  would relieve  students of  much of  that kind  of loan                                                              
debt.   He listed statistics that  indicated the level  of support                                                              
for low  income students  provided by other  states.   Mr. Hickman                                                              
acknowledged  that this  program is  not going  to fix the  entire                                                              
problem, but it is a small step.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
6:01:34 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES  asked  whether,  in  his  capacity  as  the                                                              
Director  of  Student  Support   Services,  Mr.  Hickman  assisted                                                              
students to get loans, grants, and scholarships.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR. HICKMAN  indicated that  his position is  funded by the  U. S.                                                              
Department  of Education  that supports  low-income students  with                                                              
grants, computers, and tutoring.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES  further asked  whether  there  is one  area                                                              
that is a clearing house for available scholarships.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MR. HICKMAN  said no.  His  office searches for  possibilities and                                                              
provides the information to the student.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES  then asked  whether all of  the scholarships                                                              
are distributed each year.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MR.  HICKMAN said  yes.   He added  that  his program  is able  to                                                              
award only  one-half of the  applications received.   Furthermore,                                                              
the  successful   applicants  are   required  to  apply   for  UAF                                                              
scholarships  as well.   In response  to a  question, Mr.  Hickman                                                              
stated that  the loans and scholarships  are available to  all UAF                                                              
students.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
6:03:14 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ANDY  ANGAIAK,  Director,  Upward  Bound  Program,  University  of                                                              
Alaska Fairbanks,  informed the committee  that Upward Bound  is a                                                              
federal  program,   funded  through   the  U.  S.   Department  of                                                              
Education,  which was created  by the  War on Poverty  initiatives                                                              
of  the 1960's.    Its purpose  is  to encourage  low-income  high                                                              
school  students   to  graduate  and  enter  programs   of  higher                                                              
education.   Mr. Angaiak said that  Upward Bound serves  13 Alaska                                                              
high  schools  and he  provided  statistics  on the  Upward  Bound                                                              
program.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
6:05:37 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MELANIE  K.  LEYDON,  Student,   University  of  Alaska  Anchorage                                                              
(UAA), informed the  committee that she was a freshman  at UAA and                                                              
works part-time.   She  shared her  future plans  for a  career in                                                              
Alaska.   Ms. Leydon said  that she was  speaking for  herself and                                                              
her siblings  as they are  receiving no financial  assistance from                                                              
their parents  to pay for  college.  She  asked for  the committee                                                              
to assist the future leaders of Alaska.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
6:07:05 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER  asked for the  reason Ms. Leydon  does not                                                              
receive financial support from her parents.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MS. LEYDON explained that it is a financial reason.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER  asked  whether her  parents  are  college                                                              
educated.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MS. LEYDON said no.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
6:07:50 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES asked  Ms. Leydon whether  she had  acquired                                                              
any student debt.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MS.  LEYDON, in  response to  questions, answered  that she  works                                                              
part-time to  pay cash for school,  lives at home, and  works at a                                                              
real estate office full-time in the summer.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
6:09:21 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
KEVIN  TURNBOUGH,  Representative,  Upward  Bound,  University  of                                                              
Alaska Fairbanks,  addressed the issue of need-based  students who                                                              
leave  the state  for  their education.    He  explained that  for                                                              
every Pell  grant student that  comes in  to the state  for higher                                                              
education,  five to  seven Pell  grant  students leave.   He  gave                                                              
examples   of  Upward  Bound   high  school   students  who   have                                                              
successfully    completed    high     school    under    difficult                                                              
circumstances.    These  students   need  and  deserve  additional                                                              
support in order  to attend college.  Mr. Turnbough  stressed that                                                              
the state  needs to  do more for  students coming from  low-income                                                              
backgrounds  so that they  can better  their lives through  higher                                                              
education.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
6:13:53 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES asked whether  granting a scholarship  would                                                              
guarantee that the student would stay in the state.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
MR.  TURNBOUGH said  that  there  is no  guarantee,  but it  would                                                              
increase  the  likelihood.    His  personal  experience  was  that                                                              
students feel  a commitment to their  state; however, they  do not                                                              
want to graduate with student debt.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
6:15:25 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DANA L.  THOMAS, Professor  of Statistics;  Assistant Provost  for                                                              
General Studies,  University of  Alaska Fairbanks, stated  that he                                                              
was raised  and educated in Alaska  and expressed his  support for                                                              
the bill[s].   To answer the  question of whether  students should                                                              
work, his  data indicates  that more UAF  students work  in excess                                                              
of 20  hours per week  and attend school  part-time than  in other                                                              
states.    National  research shows  that  these  students  attain                                                              
degrees at  a significantly  lower rate, and  in a greater  length                                                              
of time,  than full-time  students.   In his  own experience,  Mr.                                                              
Thomas was  able to work part-time  and pay for  college; however,                                                              
the evidence is  clear that, at the cost of education  today, that                                                              
is not  possible.   He pointed  out that,  at UAF, when  student's                                                              
reach a  debt of about  $10,000 in loans,  they tend to  drop out.                                                              
Lastly,  he related  that the  Postsecondary Education  Commission                                                              
distributed  financial aid  to 579  students  whose family  annual                                                              
income was less than $15,000.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
6:18:20 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
LINDSEY  FORREST,  President, Student  Government,  University  of                                                              
Alaska  Southeast,  stated her  support  for HB  397  and HB  403,                                                              
paraphrasing  from a  prepared statement,  which  read as  follows                                                              
[original punctuation provided]:                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     I am  the President  of the UAS  Student Government.   I                                                                   
     am  the Speaker  Pro-Tem for  the  Coalition of  Student                                                                   
     Leaders.  I  am a senior with one moreyear  to go before                                                                   
     I graduate at  UAS with a BLA in English  Literature and                                                                   
     a minor  in Law.   I wear many caps  but the one  that I                                                                   
     wear today  is that of a  student in financial need.   I                                                                   
     work seven  days a week, either  at one of my  two jobs,                                                                   
     or both,  as the  President of  the Student Body,  which                                                                   
     is a full time  job in itself, or on school  work, which                                                                   
     is   another   full   time   job.      However,   as   a                                                                   
     representative of  the students at UAS it is  my duty to                                                                   
     inform  you   that  there  area  a  number   of  my  own                                                                   
     constituents   who  would   benefit  greatly  from   the                                                                   
     passing  of HB  397y and  403 as  they currently  exist.                                                                   
     As  a  representative   of  the  Coalition   of  Student                                                                   
     Leaders  it  is  my  duty   to  inform  youthat  a  vast                                                                   
     majority  of the  constituents  of my  colleagues  would                                                                   
     benefit  hugely from the  passing of HB  397 and  403 as                                                                   
     brought to you  by the members of this  Legislative body                                                                   
     and  the members  of the  Coalition  of Studen  Leaders.                                                                   
     As a  member of this jury  it is yourduty  to deliberate                                                                   
     and express  you[r] decision on the inception  of HB 397                                                                   
     and  403.   However,  it  is  also  your duty  as  state                                                                   
     representatives  to  be  concerned  with  the  financial                                                                   
     well-being  of  your students  attending  post-secondary                                                                   
     educational  institutes in  Alaska.   It is you[r]  duty                                                                   
     as  a state  representative  to  be concerned  with  the                                                                   
     welfare of the  future of this great state.   Ladies and                                                                   
     gentlemen  of this jury  the students  before you  today                                                                   
     and the students  whose voices do not bet  [to] be heard                                                                   
     are the  future of this  state, a bright future  indeed,                                                                   
     and it  is your duty to provide  for us the means  to be                                                                   
     the growth  you wish us  to be, we  cannot do it  all on                                                                   
     our own.   Give us another avenue to seek  financial aid                                                                   
     from, give  us the means  to attend college  and further                                                                   
     our  dreams,  you  will not  [be]  disappointed  at  the                                                                   
     outcome nor  the caliber of students that  will graduate                                                                   
     and remain  in this great state  of Alaska that  we want                                                                   
     ... to  call home.  Thank  you all for your  support for                                                                   
     the students  of the University of Alaska,  your support                                                                   
     for  higher  education  and   your  support  for  making                                                                   
     Alaska a better state and better home.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
6:21:17 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES  spoke of the other needs in  the state, such                                                              
as  programs to  support  the mentally  ill  or senior  care.   He                                                              
pointed out the  difficult choice between funding  a student grant                                                              
program or  replacing federal funds  for the Department  of Health                                                              
and Social  Services.   He asked whether  a student  loan program,                                                              
with incentives  to benefit students  who stay and work  in Alaska                                                              
after  graduation,  would  be  more  effective  than  a  grant  in                                                              
growing Alaska's workforce.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MS. FORREST  responded that  she was  unsure; however,  she opined                                                              
that   supporting  the   state's   future  leaders   can  not   be                                                              
detrimental to the state.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES  said he is not necessarily  against a grant,                                                              
but all of the  options around this issue should  be explored.  He                                                              
described  his personal experience  during  his college years  and                                                              
assured  those attending  college now  that the  committee has  an                                                              
understanding of their situation.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
6:26:54 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  CISSNA pointed  out that,  without a state  income                                                              
tax,   Alaska  residents   have   a  disassociation   with   state                                                              
government.   In addition,  Alaska does  not produce a  sufficient                                                              
number  of  professionals  and must  pay  a  high price  to  bring                                                              
people in, especially  in the fields of health  and education. She                                                              
opined that  HB 397 and  HB 403 will  entice graduates to  stay in                                                              
the  state. Representative  Cissna  asked  Ms. Forrest  whether  a                                                              
large, or  a smaller,  debt after  graduation will keep  graduates                                                              
in Alaska.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MS. FORREST  responded that  a student with  a smaller  debt would                                                              
be more  willing to stay  in Alaska because  entry level  jobs pay                                                              
less here.  Her  experience is that students can  go to school and                                                              
live  more cheaply  in  other states,  thus  graduating with  less                                                              
debt.   Ms.  Forrest  shared her  personal  plan  to leave  Alaska                                                              
after graduation.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
6:31:59 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  WILSON  related   a  personal  history  of   education  and                                                              
repaying school  loans.   She then reminded  the witnesses  of the                                                              
source of the state's wealth.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
6:34:38 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON  spoke regarding  the "brain drain"  and how                                                              
students  who  go  outside  to college  choose  spouses  and  jobs                                                              
during their  time at  college and stay  outside.  If  legislators                                                              
want  people to  stay in  Alaska,  the legislature  needs to  help                                                              
them  graduate  from   college  in  Alaska.     He  expressed  his                                                              
frustration at funding  the senior bonus instead  of programs that                                                              
will keep  young people  in Alaska and  free from the  limitations                                                              
of large  amounts of debt.   Representative Seaton stated  that it                                                              
is good  policy to  provide a  program that  requires students  to                                                              
maintain a  high level  of academic  achievement and he  indicated                                                              
his support for the bill.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
6:39:03 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR WILSON closed public testimony.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
6:39:12 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
[HB 397 was held over.]                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
6:40:16 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ADJOURNMENT                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
There being no further business before the committee, the House                                                                 
Health, Education and Social Services Standing Committee meeting                                                                
was adjourned at 6:40 p.m.                                                                                                      

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